Talk:Janice Kent

Glory objective

Vio, I seriously doubt this can be described as a bug. It may be inconsistent with her lore and out of proportion in terms ofgains, but Mush is an imbalanced game like that, and her objective text has no mention of intelligent life. The fact that she is programmed togain glory in these precise events in these precise zones (any which has mention of alien life, even the Caverns stalactite accident) is the biggest proof that it is a deliberate MT decision. — ividyon (talk) 10:19, 15 March 2014 (MDT)

I removed the mention of the bug because it's pretty obviously thought out since encountering living animals in non-animal zones also receives the glory. MT has stated in the past (during beta) that the glory mechanic is intentionally imbalanced and this is simply one more example of that. Spacekadt (talk) 15:28, 15 March 2014 (MDT)

It may have been, at some point in development. But knowing a thing or two about game design, I seriously doubt that this, in its current form, can be intended. Sure, Janice is an OP character in several ways with her skills, and probably intended to be as the "titular" character... but the possibility to abuse this makes the entire glory/ranking system not only imbalanced, but a joke beyond salvation. (And saying that imbalances are intended is just some BS you tell someone to get them off your back. If that was true, in these proportions, why bother to include a ranking in the first place, or other correcting factors like diminishing returns?)

Besides, it is not just her general character which suggests she would look for intelligent life to communicate with - an Ethnologist specifically studies cultures, meaning things like customs and religion. Not spiders. - Vio (talk) 15:37, 15 March 2014 (MDT)

Also, while we can discuss the likeliness, could you please refrain from just deleting entire contributions with worthwhile info because of personal belief? Thank you. - Vio (talk) 15:43, 15 March 2014 (MDT)

We seem to have differing interpretations of what constitutes a 'bug'. A bug is a mistake in the game code, a typo or an exploit that is not part of a deliberate development decision.

You have mentioned that you "know a thing or two about game design". Now, after having said that, how can you seriously claim this is a 'bug', if, during the development cycle, it would require exact and deliberate code input by Motion-Twin to make Janice receive from all specific expedition results which involve the meeting of alien life in their flavor text (something not connected to any game mechanics)? Are you suggesting that someone at MT accidentally mashed their keyboard so hard it suddenly inserted the exact code for a check of all these specific alien-related events when implementing Janice's glory bonus? :)

To clarify the deliberate nature of her gains; Mush expeditions are split up in Zones and Events. A zone is a collection of 4 events. Now, you may look at other characters' skills and objectives, and you will see that some of them are inherently connected to specific types of zones and/or events (in Stephen's case, the Fight event). In Janice's case, however, this is a lot different; since her objective states she will gain glory from meeting alien life, special code has to be implemented in order to fulfill the objective any time something related to alien life happens, no matter where. As you well know, Janice gains at occasions which are not inherently bound to specific zone/event types, such as Caverns - Accident (Jumping to avoid a passing alien scorpion, [character] split their head open on a stalactite.) or Insects - Illness (Suddenly [character] starts screaming, and a huge glowing spider shoots out of their suit. NOBODY wants spiders scuttling around their suit!). This means that the developers had to specifically add Janice checks for any specific combination of zone & event which includes flavor text that speaks of alien encounters. If this were to be the results of a bug, it would be an incredibly unlikely and entirely unrealistic one, something akin to a room of monkeys with typewriters accidentally stumbling upon Shakespeare's collected works.

That is my main concern with your edit. By the nature of the requirements alone, it becomes clearly apparent that it is not a bug. You are absolutely right about the fact that it doesn't make any sense when viewed in connection to her part-time ethnology and diplomacy studies, and that it's likely overpowered as hell, but... that's Mush for you. And, again, disregarding lore flavor, there is no mention of intelligent life being Janice's requirement anywhere in the game text. I had assumed that my changes to your edit would be sufficient to explain this and point out the silliness behind it all, so I'm not sure why you had to return to the claims of it being a "bug".

That's also why I understand spacey's notion to remove that paragraph, although it may have been rushed a little; there is simply no evidence or, in fact, any logical reason to cite Janice's glory objective as buggy. I hope my explanation clarifies this; if not, please feel free to respond. — ividyon (talk) 16:39, 15 March 2014 (MDT)

As stated in my very first sentence, it may well have been designed like that at some point. The "alien check" obviously was, and I never said it was "random". Nor am I inclined to discuss semantics.

As you agree, it is a blatant flaw, if you prefer that term, no matter how it came to pass. One that can happen (you have no idea how chaotic such things can be with several people working on it, epsecially on a budget), but should not knowingly be left in a game which at the same time presents glory as something meaningful and shows obvious attempts of trying to create balance in such things.

And whether you call it "bug" or "relic", a "design flaw", an "oversight" or whatver - the main message is that it's out of proportion. And though Janice players may not like reading it, that is simply a fact. - Vio (talk) 17:15, 15 March 2014 (MDT)

There is a difference between bugs, imbalances and lore discrepancies, and it's fairly important to keep the distinction between them clear. I've edited the sentence in a way that should bring your intended message across without causing misunderstandings. — ividyon (talk) 17:26, 15 March 2014 (MDT)

Rare Event

On my (English server) ship I just came across the event where a mush character accidentally lets slip that they are mush. I see this verified in the French wiki but no mention of it here, so I wanted to bring it up to be included. I don't know much beyond the character says something to the effect of "My life was okay until the mush entered it". I'm not sure if this should go with Janice or the Shrink skill. Link to relevant french page http://www.twinpedia.com/mush/competences/humains look for Psy